Potential MisMatch Errors

[Mike Nomad]

Greetings mappers....

I've managed to obtain the new maps and all their associated files for the imminent update from Tripwire.

I have, from intensive testing, discovered that certain maps we now enjoy will apparently have problems with the 10 new updated maps and their files. As some of you may recall, I was against the embedding of custom files for Muts, models, skins, etc... unless they are/were universally applied and under the control of Tripwire.

Perhaps, the inclusion of these custom files in "MYLEVEL" is in fact, a mistake altogether. Keeping all custom files separate and apart from a map's internal file structure is perhaps, the only way to go.

Seems that when I ran maps that had the m1939 cannons in them on a test server that had the new map pack and its files also present... the cannons in the maps present that were not in the update were broken.

They were visibly and functionally broken. Visibly, the cannons were now squat with a very low profile and functionally, they seemingly were indestructible.

Of course, all of this may be moot upon the release of the anxiously awaited update/fixes/patches presently in testing by TW. I thought it best that mappers be forewarned of the possible need for custom map updates.

[Reservoir Dog]

Forgive me Mike but I'm a little confused....

Did you receive any file type mismatch errors?

It didn't sound like you did. You wouldn't have been able to run the maps not in the update if you had. This error is present while loading a map and does not let you run it.

The M1939 gun is not embedded into "my level". That is why there is a dependence upon the external files. Are new files for the M1939 gun included with the update? Did the update instruct you to replace all of the files for the gun or just some?

If there is a problem with the guns now its it because Tripwire has updated these files, instead of using version numbers in the filename. If these files were "embedded" into the map under mylevel then you wouldn't see a change at all to the original maps, no matter what updates Tripwire does to the files. This of course would require altering the code somewhat so that everything is ran internally in the map and no dependency to external files.

Unfortunately, you will also see the same problem with Tractorworks and Berezina as they have set these weapons up the same way as other maps that have these guns in it. Since the designers of the gun are also the designers of these maps, mappers felt this is a blueprint of how it should be done.

When I tried to ask Slyke under the Hubes breakout thread on RO forums why he said not to integrate this mod into maps, I just got "i don't knows" instead of answering direct questions. He never said "embed" which is the correct term for using "mylevel". He said integrate which means not use these mods at all in a map. Being he has used them in his maps, I and others felt it was ok to use in their's. If the AHz maps will have to be remake then the others will too. This is just following the lead of the original designers.

How are they visibly broken and low profile? A picture would really help. How are they different in the new map? I'm confused because if the files changed the appearance and functionality in the old maps how would they not be the same in the new ones? They would have to use different code/files to do this so I'm a little confused. It would help if you would let us know what files were replaced (all or some) to the M1939 gun in the update. What files were used in the new maps that are different from the ones that are used now? That would give us something to go on.

[=GG= Mr Moe]

Are you talking about....

EX: Months ago I moved many of the AHz vehicle and gun files to my system folder. Then with the new tests coming out with the updates, I had to remove those from my system folder because of mismatch errors to get everything to run...

Mismatch errors like that example?

(obviously I don't have those other files from TWI as you do.... :) )

[Mike Nomad]

Are you talking about....

EX: Months ago I moved many of the AHz vehicle and gun files to my system folder. Then with the new tests coming out with the updates, I had to remove those from my system folder because of mismatch errors to get everything to run...

Mismatch errors like that example?

(obviously I don't have those other files from TWI as you do.... :) )

Exactly...

[Mike Nomad]

The M1939 gun is not embedded into "my level". That is why there is a dependence upon the external files. Are new files for the M1939 gun included with the update? Did the update instruct you to replace all of the files for the gun or just some?

No instructions yet... but it overwrote all the previous files and threw mismatches out for those files it didn't overwrite. Those had to be deleted and gotten either via redirect or recreated by the program.

Unfortunately, you will also see the same problem with TractorWorks and Berezina as they have set these weapons up the same way as other maps that have these guns in it. Since the designers of the gun are also the designers of these maps, mappers felt this is a blueprint of how it should be done.

Berezina has been changed quite a bit - instead of fixing the DEAD TURRET BUG a tanker need not get out of his tank to cap those objective he had to previously dismount to do so.. It almost as if it an early Berezina with the BT7 and M1939 cannons in it. At this rate, any map that has the M1939 is broken.

When I tried to ask Slyke under the Hubes breakout thread on RO forums why he said not to integrate this mod into maps, I just got "i don't knows" instead of answering direct questions. He never said "embed" which is the correct term for using "mylevel". He said integrate which means not use these mods at all in a map. Being he has used them in his maps, I and others felt it was ok to use in their's. If the AHz maps will have to be remake then the others will too. This is just following the lead of the original designers.

I'm inclined to say EMBED... make each and every map independent of and immune to *any* extraneous influences. Otherwise, you are at the mercy of sudden or last minute changes or the whims of "whomever" at making things "their way".

How are they visibly broken and low profile? A picture would really help. How are they different in the new map? I'm confused because if the files changed the appearance and functionality in the old maps how would they not be the same in the new ones? They would have to use different code/files to do this so I'm a little confused. It would help if you would let us know what files were replaced (all or some) to the M1939 gun in the update. What files were used in the new maps that are different from the ones that are used now? That would give us something to go on.

With the updated files, yet to be finished and released... The M1939, in maps not included in the map pak, is now a squat invulnerable cannon with the barrel very low between the wheels - it looks and works great in the modified Berezina... but its awful in the other, non-updated maps.

In VOD it almost disappears behind the sand bags. It becomes useless and ugly.

Again, perhaps Embedding in MY LEVEL is the way to protect map integrity in general and especially for those maps not in the upcoming map pak.

[Reservoir Dog]

It's really too bad TWI has adjusted the Berezina map instead of fixing the tank shell load bug. I remember you and someone else mentioning problems with that map under that bug thread on RO forums. This will be a lingering problem with tank maps, but won't be so noticable now on the "polished" new map. Not the direction I would have gone with.

As far as the M1939 guns, TWI decided to replace some files and not others. This will definitely cause those type mismatch errors. It will also cause the replaced files to be used by exisiting maps to alter some, but not all parts of the gun. They could have gone with all new files names, since they "polished" the maps and had to redo the links anyway, or replace all of the files. It's almost as if TWI wanted to cause both of these issues on purpose. Each mapper that is using these guns will have to make adjustments and release a new map. If that is what needs to be done, then that's what we will do.